Curse

Chuchin · Jun 14, 2007, 12:24 AM // 00:24

Hi all you people. I'm having some troubles with my first and unique character, i started to play GW about 2 weeks ago. I got only the NightFall Campaign (i decided complete this one before buying the next 2 campaigns) so im a bit limited, but im in the "art of making builds". The thing is that im short of money so i thought about farming, and a "build" cames to my head. So i made the following build:

Warrior/Elementalist

12 Axe Mastery
12 Earth Magic

-Stoneflesh Aura
-Armor of Earth
-Executioner's strike
-Cyclone Axe
-Disrupting Chop
-Dismember
-Power Attack
-Berserker Stance

My armor is full of Radiant Insignias and Runes of Attunement. Im about 480 hp and 41 energy. I got Totem Axe.

The thing is that i made the build to farm Bugs (termites to be exactly) in Arjkok Zone, right to Yohlon Haven. I go good with these guys, i get no dmg but the problem is that there always are a Group of 3 termites with a Monk... so when i start to make the "cake" of bugs, i use cyclone axe.. the dmg is well, but the Monks makes me the life impossible, unabling to kill anything... so i ran out of energy and then my char dies...

That's the problem, so i dunno... any other place to farm with this build or any suggestion? I can try changing the place for some other place in the campaign that have phisical damage and no monks to make my life miserable.

Dunno, i hear you expert people, i ran out of ideas... im kinda n00b yet.

Thank you very much.

ArKaiN · Jun 14, 2007, 04:01 AM // 04:01

Triple Chop is the correct elite. And you don't really need Stoneflesh, you can pile up on armor(until the next patch at least) and not get hurt. The only reason to go /E in such a build would be a Conjure to add damage to the mob. There's no good use for berserker stance for now.

beltran13579 · Jun 14, 2007, 05:19 AM // 05:19

you would probably need to use a zealous axe to keep ur energy up

Darkpower Alchemist · Jun 14, 2007, 06:41 AM // 06:41

The holes in your build are based on the lack of 2 skills.

[skill=big]Gladiator's defense[/skill]

[skill=big]Dolyak Signet[/skill]

Sad to say, this is where the warrior farmer mostly gets his backbone from. Heavy damage absorption without these 2 is destined for failure. Instead of Berserker's stance, you need flail to build more adrenaline. You have no healing and you're farming,so you have some tweeks to do. I understand the want for Earth magic to give extra armor, but your build is fataly flawed.

Time to get back to the drawing board.

blue.rellik · Jun 14, 2007, 07:40 AM // 07:40

He only has Nightfall so Dolyak and Triple Chop won't help him.

RotteN · Jun 14, 2007, 09:02 AM // 09:02

dump your energy attacks, go with adrenalin attacks instead
take flail instead of berserker stance and spec some in strength to make it worth wile.

I don't know if you can outdamage that monk, but the bugs use frenzy right, so you should be able to kill those by using cleave as DPS skill.

get a zealous axe, it will get you more energy, specially when using flail

LifeInfusion · Jun 15, 2007, 02:13 AM // 02:13

12 Axe Mastery
12 Earth Magic

-Stoneflesh Aura
-Armor of Earth
-Executioner's strike
-Cyclone Axe
-Disrupting Chop
-Dismember
-Power Attack
-Berserker Stance

*dismember for monks --> take out power attack
*flail as IAS, as it doesn't end as easily--> take out berserker stance
*Zealous axe
*bring a heal (heal sig/lion's comfort)

stoneflesh really isn't needed, tbh. Just use a shield with absorption -2 while in a stance.

ArKaiN · Jun 15, 2007, 04:01 AM // 04:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by Age

You won't be doing any damage without points in strength as your primary attribute and what about tactics how are you going to heal?It is like someone said doylak signet.You need your axe mastery,strength and tactics.Then you can add a few points in earth.

What? Strength barely adds any damage at all(http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...hp?t=10163821). The reason for putting points into str is *only* buffing the good skills the line has.

Stormlord Alex · Jun 15, 2007, 08:33 AM // 08:33

Most PvP warrior builds run Bull's Strike, Rush, Enraging Charge etc. too.
Strength really adds almost no damage.

RotteN · Jun 15, 2007, 09:00 AM // 09:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by Age

In most PvP Warrior builds they put 10 in strength if you look at all their builds.

i use 8 or 9, and that has nothing to do with damage, but with getting decent performance on enraging charge/rush/...

if you don't use strength skills, there's no reason to spec in strength.

LifeInfusion · Jun 15, 2007, 10:09 PM // 22:09

Strength only adds armor penetration, not damage onto attack SKILLS. That means most of the time it isn't helping.

The only reason to spec in strength is to pump up the effectiveness of skills like Bull's strike or enraging charge and the like.

blue.rellik · Jun 16, 2007, 12:35 AM // 00:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by Age

This is like saying a Ranger doesn't points in expertise or a Monk doesn't need point in Devine Favour or a Necros doesn't need points in Soul Reaping or a Ele doesn't need points in Energy storage etc etc.

Warriors need points in their primary attribute to be more effective.

With 1 in Strength and 13 in axe and 13 in earth what damage are you going to do very little.It will be a long fight as well.

That's a bad example because Expertise, Divine Favor, Soul Reaping and Energy Storage are actually pretty good since it benefits them more or less 100% of the time

Strength however does not

Stormlord Alex · Jun 16, 2007, 01:15 AM // 01:15

Age... what aren't you getting?
It's been proven with, you know... *actual* numbers that Strength sucks shit. It is PURELY about the skills, if you aren't using any Strength skills then there is absolutely NO reason to spec in Strength. Unless, you've got 2-3 spare points... 2% penetration can't hurt

The examples you gave were terrible ones - even using no skills from them, they all provide a considerable bonus just by having them - energy management, burst capacity, etc. Strength - spec'd in, and no skills -does nothing for you.
To answer your question:

'With 1 in Strength...'

You'll still do similar damage as if you had a higher Strength.
I'll reiterate - Strength adds VERY LITTLE actual damage. The fact that it is *puny* penetration on attack skills *ONLY* makes it a terrible waste of attributes.

Cathode_Reborn · Jun 16, 2007, 08:07 AM // 08:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by Age

Then explain to me the 2 most popular builds in PvP as to why they use 10 in strength.These being the Shock/Frenzy Warrior and the IWAY Warrior.
Shock/Frenzy uses only Sprint as its strength skill
IWAY use only Iway as its strength skill

I run 10 in strength and all I use is sprint myself the rest being sword and tactics.I mostly use a PvP set up not tanking set up.

Obviously, Shock/Frenzy build has points in strength cause it has Sprint >_> As for the IWAY build, you're gonna have to be more specific, it's changed alot. The fact that you think it's worth putting points in strength just for extra damage while you're using a sword is kinda silly.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Age

Warriors need points in their primary attribute to be more effective.

With 1 in Strength and 13 in axe and 13 in earth what damage are you going to do very little.It will be a long fight as well.

Warriors need points in their primary attribute to make their skills more effective, not their damage. I imagine you don't play a warrior if you say he's doing very little damage when he has 12 in axe mastery (or possibly more from runes).

Quote:

Originally Posted by Age

In most PvP Warrior builds they put 10 in strength if you look at all their builds.

If you're gonna just look at others and copy what they do, you should also understand why they do it.

Have fun with some numbers: http://www.guildwarsguru.com/calculators/guru_armor.php Keep in mind that strength applies to attack skills only

Stormlord Alex · Jun 16, 2007, 09:05 AM // 09:05

They use 10 Strength because... *drum roll* They use Strength skills! Ta-da!

Now, look at a Steady Stance warrior, shall we?
This is the GvG variant off PvXwiki, so it happens to be a competitive (read: efficient) build.

Steady Stance / Drunken Blow / Desperation Blow / Critical Chop / Signet of Malice / Fear Me! / Healing Signet / Resurrection Signet

Wow-ee, would ya look at that, not a Strength skill in sight

And... Funnily enough... It runs all of 3 strength (12 tactcs, 12 axe, and rest dumped in Strength).

Most PvP warrior builds only use as much Strength as they need to for the skills they use, because PvP warriors are smart enough to realise STRENGTH SUCKS.

Darkpower Alchemist · Jun 16, 2007, 09:38 AM // 09:38

The need for strength attribute stems from 3 things.

1)Armor Penetration
2)Skill effectiveness increases
3)The skills you use that are effected

The strength spec of 10 is basic in most warrior builds also because the same populous that denounces strength, also denounces tactics as useful only for the heal sig and the stances for farming. Lion's Comfort brings both attribute lines together, yet LC is useless with no adrenaline. So, HS still dominates. It's an odd dance, since people hate both stat lines and feel they are a waste.

If people could have a weapon att of above 16, they probably would do it instead of strength.

ArKaiN · Jun 18, 2007, 11:02 PM // 23:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by Age

I sure do play a Warrior or over 2 years now since back in beta and was making builds up in RA.I like Darkpower Alchemist said find my attack skill more effective with more strength and tested this out on the Namless Island and worked better with high points in stength even though I was only useing my sword skills.

Jesus christ what's wrong with you?
It's not that people are just *guessing* str doesn't add damage. It's been proven on multiple occasions
YOU ARE WRONG. ACCEPT IT AND MOVE ON.
You know what, this kind of behavior actually ticks me off. I'm taking a trip to dummy land and taking multiple screenshots.

HERE.

0 str, armor 60:

13 str, armor 60:

0 str, armor 80:

13 str, armor 80:

0 str, armor 100:

13 str, armor 100:

Now, you might argue that 7-8 damage is worth 13 points into an attribute, but then I'd have to tell you to get your head examined.

ArKaiN · Jun 19, 2007, 06:10 PM // 18:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by Age

There is nothing wrong with me and the skill you chose is WildBlow a non attributed skill any /W can use it as well.The sreenshot that seems to do the most damage is the one with Strength in it and that armour lvl being at 60.I took on the armour lvl of 100 with sword,Think about this reversal of fortune can negate that very easy as if there 0 damage taken and the same when you have nothing in strength.I started my first Warrior back in beta and been playing it since.

It is is this one that is doing the most with strength in it with wildblow.

What in the name of Satan are you talking about?!
Yes, it does add a little bit of damage, at ATTRIBUTE 13.

Here:
[skill]wild blow[/skill]

and here:
http://gw.gamewikis.org/wiki/Critical_hit

I picked wild blow because it always results in a critical hit, meaning the damage is constant. You'd think someone who's had "a warrior since beta" or whatever would know something like this (every damage test is done with wild blow).
I have proven strength adds 7-8 points to your damage at most. YOU CAN SEE IT WITH YOUR OWN EYES.
Seriously, if a DEMONSTRATION doesn't convince you, I think you need to stop posting advice on other threads, and seek a psychiatrist's help.

martialis · Jun 19, 2007, 06:26 PM // 18:26

Intelligence and literacy are not requirements for giving advice on a fan forum. He's been posting similar stuff for as long as it's been, and isn't likely to stop any time soon.

Somebody hasn't been listening...

ArKaiN · Jun 20, 2007, 05:08 AM // 05:08

That may be, but this dude's forum account is from 2005.
How does he not know this stuff?